Fan Designed Cosmic Expansion Set Discussion

Christopher Aurel Oliveira: I think there needs to be a qualification on his auto-loss for swapping in a card from the discard pile. Perhaps it should rule that “non-encounter cards swapped in are treated as Attack 00”. (1 thumb up)

Jack Reda: I have to echo the opinion that swapping in non-encounter cards is ill-advised. I like the power better when it's just playing an encounter card from the discard pile.

Matthew Scrivner: Question: why does the power state that only the Grifter may look through the discard pile? (Isn't the discard pile and its contents public knowledge?)

Bill Eberle: Our sense is that the Grifter should override that rule. So, “not when the Grifter is in the game.” (2 thumbs up)

Christopher Aurel Oliveira: I think the ability for him to swap in a non-encounter card is unique in that a secondary use of his power is to “Void” cards right out of the game, but suffer a loss for it. However I stand by my thought that the non-encounter card has to be TREATED as an Attack 00 for their to be harmony with the rules, much like how Warhawk does his thing.

Ales Smrdel: Name idea: Palterer, have the power to palter, bargin, dicker (I believe the last one is already used on an alien in warp database)

Matthew Scrivner: @Bill - a thought for another day; the idea of discard deck control makes me think there ought to be another power that can exploit the discard pile. Scavenger or Garbage Man...
As far as attack 00 versus auto-lose, if you are designing with the idea in mind that many groups play multiple powers, than an auto-lose condition may be a desirable secondary effect for comboing.

Jack Reda: I think secondary power effects are only worth it for powers that don't have a good primary effect. In this case, being able to take ANY encounter card that has been discarded is pretty good. Keep in mind, you are replacing an encounter card you played. Having it be for a non-encounter card is just weird. (1 thumb up)

Peter: @Matthew Scrivner yes discard is a bit under exploited...

Bill Martinson: @Jack: Exactly! Dumping an attack 04 to re-use a 20 or 30 from the discard pile is HUGE! It doesn't need a secondary, non-thematic ability of vaporizing non-encounter cards.

@Bill E: I don't think the fact that a name is “in use” in Jack's database should mean we can't consider it. There are many names that have three, four, or more different implementations in the database. Just because somebody threw together a homebrew in five minutes with a particular name doesn't mean that name should be off-limits for the rest of all time. Can we agree that the best names should probably go to the *best* designs, not just the *first* ones? (2 thumbs up)

Peter Olotka: OK - it's archived...so is it a consensus that GRIFTER (including Super and Wild ) is a BETA wrap? If so, Next up playtesting.....

Jack Reda: Exactly Bill! POD all the way! :)

Bill Martinson: I agree with Stephen ... the “con artist” concept really should be the Grifter. This concept we're working on now is more of somebody who...
* learns from history
* re-uses discarded technology
* jury-rigs a last-minute solution
* upgrades his hardware from a secret laboratory
* has hidden advisors

... something along those lines. It's not really a confidence game if it doesn't suck the opponent into making a decision based on false information. From the opponent's perspective, this is just Miser or Cryo or a Quark Battery that's getting a card from the discard pile instead of a hoard or cold storage or battery location. Not much of a con.

Don't get me wrong, I really like how the power is developing! But it seems more like a RECYCLER or an ENGINEER or a STRATEGIST (drawing on tactics that were earlier “learned”) than a con man.

Ales Smrdel: Sounds to me like he is creating an ad-hoc solution from resources available at hand ... kind of like makeshifting ... Makeshifter; have the power to rig?